Marni Kagan

Professional Matchmaker from Manhattan — on Leaving Law for Love, What Drives People to Seek Matchmaking, How to Manage Expectations, and 16 Years of Helping Couples Find Each Other

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67 minutes
Matchmaking · Dating · Love · Relationships · NYC

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About the Guest

Marni Kagan — Professional Matchmaker, Manhattan

Marni Kagan embodies what it means to be yourself. Sixteen years ago she made the bold decision to leave her established career as an attorney and pursue what she felt could be her true path — bringing a modern, human-centered approach to one of the oldest professions in the world.

Over the years Marni has become one of the best matchmakers in the business, building her brand in the heart of Manhattan. She is known for the depth of her client relationships, her ability to see past a checklist to what someone truly needs, and the genuine care she brings to every introduction she facilitates.

Career Path
Attorney → Professional Matchmaker in Manhattan — 16 years building her brand and reputation in one of the most competitive dating markets in the world.
Her City
Manhattan, New York City — where she established herself as one of the top matchmaking professionals in the area.
What She Does
Professional matchmaking and relationship coaching — helping individuals find compatible partners and building self-awareness along the way.
Her Mission
Helping people find real, lasting love — and taking pride in every happy couple and every family she has had a part in creating.

Key Quotes

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I think love is gratitude

Marni Kagan
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your person is out there and it just takes one

Marni Kagan
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you can't strive for these perfect setups because a lot of times everything on paper is there and there's no chemistry

Marni Kagan

Episode Chapters

0:00Intro0:47Happy Valentine’s Day4:09Background and Getting into Matchmaking8:06Challenges You Faced in the Beginning10:20What is the Motivation for People to Seek Matchmaking Services?19:28What Does the Process Look Like for Your Client?24:00Benefits of Coaching28:30How to Manage Expectations32:30The More Limitations — The Harder is The Process36:30Women Want to Get Married More than Men?39:36Setting Up The Meeting42:30Most Memorable Case Studies44:50What Did You Learn in 16 Years51:30What Do You Love the Most About Your Job?53:45What Is Your Least Favorite Part?55:55Social Polls to Know Your Audience57:56Dos and Don’ts During Dates59:55Do Women Want to Pay for Themselves?1:02:30Women Prefer a Man to Have a Plan1:05:50What is Love and Final Advice from Marni
BTW: This episode of the Be Yourself Podcast is produced by Beverly Media. Also on the show:
Bill Fanning — CEO of TALK Talent on Authentic Leadership, Curiosity & Meaningful Relationships →

Full Transcript

0:00Intro
Marniokay this is a sensitive topic and It's Tricky
Serhiimaybe you can give your definition of love because Love Is in the Air
Marnias far as advice I want to give for anyone listening who feels frustrated in not meeting their right matches I would say shake things up um
Marnithat's my job to do my due diligence to make sure that when I put my client on a date and setting them up with someone the person on the other end has the same genuine goal usually marriage and family that my clients who come to me they're most of them are looking to get married for the first time and and have children
Serhiican you tell us about the challenges that you had to overcome I mean there's a lot a lot of hard work that goes into building your brand making you know your name
Serhiieverybody Welcome To Be Yourself podcast the podcast on expressing our true selves today I have a very special guest in Mary Kagan she's a professional Matchmaker from New York Marney hello welcome to the podcast
0:47Happy Valentine's Day
Marnihello oh thank you for having me on
Serhiiyou're very much welcome today is a special day Valentine's Day Happy Valentine's Day
MarniHappy Valentine's Day
Serhiiand I thought it's such a great coincidence that we are recording it today and discussing love discussing love yeah absolutely how how's your day started tell tell us a little bit about maybe a FR of of you of Valentine's Day in your family
Marniuh you know to be totally Frank um my husband and I have never been big Valentine's Day people um I think for reasons we can get into later but in essence you know I think you expressed your love for your partner hopefully 365 days a year and do kind thoughtful things for them uh but I think with my son who's eight you know we we do a little bit extra for him on Valentine's Day so last year I got him a cute little bow that had Hearts it said I seriously love you it was a cereal bowl filled it with you know pink and red M&M's um got him a card this year we got some fun Valentine's Day cookies and I'm going to pick up a few more things for him so I think for my my son it's like a fun thing for the kids they give each other Valentine's Day Valentine's notes I think in school but you know for us you know we we really I genuinely feel that uh it's sweet to do Valentine's I think especially when you're dating you know when you're single and you're in the dating pool but I think yeah I would assume many married couples will say yeah it's like a sweet holiday but you don't need to go um to town for this particular day
Serhiithis is this is actually really really like for me personally something that I can resonate with because uh this is especially much more um beautiful if you when you express your love and make some gesture unexpectedly when you buy flowers or something
MarniI don't think any person would complain if their spouse wants to pick up a you know nice bouquet of flowers today or bring them some chocolates it's certainly nice you know um do I think you need to go out to a five-star restaurant for a full sitdown dinner on Valentine's Day you know I don't I don't think that's necessary
SerhiiI was just going to say when people are single or newly dating I think the gesture and it could even be just a nice card where someone expresses their emotions and how much they care about the person I think that goes a long way
MarniI think especially frankly for the women if the guy gets a card and says I'm I'm so enjoying spending time with you getting to know you I think you're amazing I I I think that's more meaningful than the than the chocolates but I'm I'm or maybe in in tandem with the chocolates uh so I think when you're single or in a new relationship I think there's a lot of stock put on this day and I I certainly understand that
Serhiiyeah I actually agree actually you you might put in much more work into coming up with perfect sign or a wordss for a person than just buying maybe some generic gift
4:09Background and Getting into Matchmaking
SerhiiMarney let's get into your background tell us a little bit about yourself and how did you get into professional matchmaking in the first place
Marnisure so uh I started matchmaking professionally it'll be 16 years uh this spring so um but prior to I was an attorney I practiced law for 10 years and um short story he'll give you the bridge version but um a conversation about dating in New York with um a friend and uh just the challenges that are out there and the at the time apps didn't exist but the old school you know match.com kind of things were out there and we were just having a conversation over dinner about the challenges and even the challenges on online and sometimes you know you know the dishonesty and people misrepresenting themselves and these are strangers and you know the pros and cons of the the online dating site and just the conversation with this friend you know I said you know I should start my own business I feel like you know I can improve upon everything that's out there and it was not something that I had ever even really thought about before and even when I said it it was just like you know thrown out there and my friend looked at me and he said Marne you should do this you're the one person I know could do this I always had a very diverse network of friends very outgoing meet people everywhere I I go and uh we then actually finished our dinner not even continuing to talk about it and the next day when I was at my firm and thinking about it I just couldn't stop thinking about it and that night I literally went home and and Drew up a business plan and I thought if I'm going to do this how would I do this what do I know about dating in New York uh what do I know about the apps about how people want to or at that time sorry the online and how people want to meet each other and from that moment within 24 hours of the conversation to the to the dating uh to the business plan I really just stayed with me like I'm going to do this and uh a month later I gave my notice at my law firm and I started my business it really just took I just felt like this is something I can do and I can do really well and there's a need for this and as I mentioned that was 16 years ago
Serhiiwow so that was a love from first sight in terms of you profession
Marniyeah yeah no I just said it when my friend said it I I thought he's right I can do this it's daunting to leave something you know I went to law school I prhs it's for 10 years it's it's daunting to leave something you know um and I'll be honest and my family initially thought maybe I had lost my nine they're like you're going to leave the law you know your area of expertise in the law and all the time you've put into that to start this business and you know what they didn't know as much what it what I knew was there's a need for it there's a there's really a need and I can get into why and even maybe more so now because of the apps there's a need for like the old school matchmaking um but I I knew there was a need and I knew that I was the person to do it and so I think once they saw well you know the business took off I started to you know have marriages and babies do my credit and I had at one point you know a large you know team of people working with me I got on the news I was in the newspaper you know they said oh this is this this this is is going to stick this is going somewhere and again you know that was that feels like forever ago um and of course I had my own learning curve in the beginning uh which we can get into um but I I have never looked back and and I would tell anyone who's looking to start a new business matchmaking or otherwise um you know to to to think it out and know the the challenges and the you know the space but go for your dream you know that that's what I would say it's it's a big step but I think you're doing it and when you start your own business it can be daunting but it's also so rewarding
Serhiiabsolutely and it's so inspiring that especially for such a high-profile profession that you had you were courageous enough to actually as a switch gears to almost some something completely different even though I do believe that your communication skills and network play to your advantage but still there were so many things that were definitely new for you
8:06Challenges You Faced in the Beginning
Serhiican you tell us about the challenges that you had to overcome as you were starting
Marnisure well I think like with any new business there's there's a learning curve and and learning um just you wear every hat right you're you're the the salesperson you're the actual person doing the services you're the bookkeeper you're are you're everything so I think there was a learning curve on that and even just kind of getting my name out there and I worked really really hard to do that when I look back at how I started my business I mean I was at everything I could possibly go to to build my network I would sometimes go to you know two or three events in a given day a birthday party a charity event I mean literally five or six nights a week um I I really everywhere I went I would you know organically connect with people I used to be in the Hampton's a lot where a lot of single New Yorkers go um so I was always I was always networking which is part of building you know any business relationships but I also wanted people to know that I um that I knew what I was you know doing I wrote a Blog for many years I had a radio program of my own for a while um I also threw my own events for many years I mean there's a lot a lot of hard work that goes into building your brand and making you know your name uh but I'm I'm lucky to say at this point 16 years later um yeah I it's so much word of mouth I have former clients who send their friends family members colleagues to me people people find me more which is really nice i' I'm proud to you know say I build a reputation in the space and and I just get you know people who know me sending their most you know loved ones and dear family uh members and friends to me
Serhiiso obviously you mentioned that the demand is there it's through the roof and it's not going away regardless of how many dating apps there are
10:20What is the Motivation for People to Seek Matchmaking Services?
Serhiiwhat is the common motivation for people seeking professional assistance in in in a pretty intimate area of their life can you let's talk about your audience a little bit
Marnisure well that's a great question and I actually just saw that CBS did a segment on Modern matchmaking you know traditional matchmaking becoming even more in demand right now because of the app so uh that was on CVS morning just like the other day uh yesterday yesterday um I think you know they talked about it because the apps are great in theory and I and I and I think people actually in reality meet their matches on the app so you know certainly there are couples who meet but also in between there's a lot of wasted time there's a lot of misrepresentation there's a lot of ghosting there's a lot of bad behavior there's a lot of scamming even um people have to be careful of uh there are a lot of pitfalls to the act so I I never want to write them off entirely because I think if you use it wisely certainly you could meet somebody through the apps but I feel like you have to be kind of like a detective and you have to be really smart maybe that's speaking to someone before you meet them in person doing some due diligence that way um so that's that why people come to me I think often they've just kind of had it with the apps um some of my clients have never been on the apps um I have a client she's divorced she's newly entering the the dating space and and she's very very private and that and that's just not a a space she wants to go into um other people they've been on the apps a long time but they're just finding either one they're seeing the same people they're not having access to new people or they don't like the process um they trust me to do my due diligence and that's where I'm entirely different experience than the apps um when when I take on a client I am finding people through my network so often th those connections are just you know one or two degree removed from who they you know from who I know uh meaning it might be one of my closest friends cousins brothers who I'm telling them about someone who's been a family friend you know for decades let's just say um or you know someone uh right now I'm setting up someone I met his brother in my building we got to talking and I thought he was great he's engaged and I said do you or your fiance know anybody wonderful there were a wonderful adorable young couple and he said my brother and I'm literally setting up as brother next me so those are very organic connections um and then I do my screening I you know vent out all the things that my clients would want to know in advance which you don't get from the apps there's there's there's a handful of pictures and minimal information about anybody on an app you know I'm finding out is there compatibility religiously in observance level is there compatibility politically it is a very charged political climate right now and a lot of my clients don't want to get on a date if there's just you know vastly different um viewpoints and values where
Serhiiyeah no and it's and it's hard for people to kind of interrogate people on that in their first messaging on an app you know it's it's heavy to talk about um but also some people want to know because they don't want to get on a date and then have that come up in their conversation and realize there's just a major disconnect there
Marniso those are things I'm finding out I think you know my job is to screen for for seriousness how serious is this person about wanting to be in a committed relationship there's a lot on the apps where people might put that they are and in reality they're looking for something else you know maybe something casual hooking up who knows what their goals are but they can say otherwise um but the reality is they're not looking for something serious the people who come through me my clients the people I'm setting them up with um that's my job to do my due diligence to make sure that when I put my client on a date and setting them up with someone the person on the other end has the same genuine goals usually marriage and family that my clients come to me they most of them are looking to get married for the first time and and have children and that's really you know what's driving them to connect with me and have them try something different uh because the apps or or whatever else is not working for them
Serhiiso how do you actually uncover those hidden desires or characteristics how do you CER of investigate this it's actually pretty sensitive information especially if the person doesn't know you so how do you navigate through this
Marnithat's a great question because it's true I I end up knowing my clients very well but sometimes when I'm screening someone who's not a direct connection to me it is a friends brother colleague whomever they are you know new to me I'm new to them and I'm asking sometimes you know personal question um I start I talk to everyone don't know 30 45 minutes in a phone call before I even meet them to screen out the major stuff um and then if everything else that seems to be on point then I meet everyone for coffee I meet everyone before I set them up with my client in person
Serhiiso I'm now you don't do online thing or do you
Marnino no I mean there there if someone is a match for a potential match for my client I meet that person for coffee and spend another hour in person talking the wide range of things talking about a wide range of things and sometimes you know usually when I get to iners meetings it's a go but sometimes there's something about them in person that I think this person is not going to be a fit for my client or vice versa uh sometimes in the course of our conversation additional things come out I happened not that long ago I was meeting someone for one of my female clients and then as I'm talking to him I I shifted gears I said you know what the woman I was thinking of is not a great fit I have someone else I think would be a better fit and they ended up really hitting it off and actually dating for a few months it didn't work out uh that's the tough part of the job we can get to um but just his talking to him his energy the things we talked about I just got a a really better read for him in person and I think it's really critical to meet everybody in person uh so that is very important to me and I can tell you that I already know someone is serious even if they're not my client if they're taking the time to talk to me on the phone if they're taking the time to meet with me you know in person over a coffee then I know that's already a good you know tell tell son they're they're taking this seriously because I've had the case in the past where guys I I kind of knew but not really socially years ago he said Mar you know me why do we need to meet for copy you know me and I said I don't know you I don't even I know you socially from the hamoods I don't know anything about you and his his reluctance to do that I went back to my client and I said I don't think he's serious because I'm willing to meet him on a Saturday or a Sunday after work I'll come to his neighborhood I'll make it as easy as possible but the fact that he's not like sure because honestly Sergey most of the people say Mar I'm an open book ask me whatever it is you want to know this is your business I know your clients take this seriously this is your job to find out and and that means even sometimes now I go into people's dating history you know tell me about you know if their divorced what happened in your marriage not to be nosy or prying um or just if they'd had long-term relationships sometimes they were engaged and that got called up so I can understand what was right in that and what wasn't right and when when people obviously let clein showare their dating history but the other person does too they might tell me ultimately you know what this person was wonderful and and lovely but this is where we had a disconnect and I might hear that and say you know what that's not a match from my client either because of some differences whatever that it might be so I'm I'm walking through you know some like you said some some sensitive topics uh but but everyone pretty much says like I'm an open book this is your job ask me what you need to know so I really don't find push back I mean I'm not getting too personal but am finding out the things that my client would want to know and and likewise they're finding out about my client I'll tell people ask me anything things that are relevant to you if there's any deal breakers for you you know let's make sure we're all at the same page so by the time two people meet they have a lot of information about each other and why they would hit it up and that's a big part of what I do besides the empirical you know okay age appropriate and you know similar observance levels and politically aligned okay great there's a whole another level of matching after that is are these going to get each other this guy's very sporty and active is she active they have a similar lifestyle this woman is more cerebral and likes deep conversations is he going to be someone who would engage with her that way and and that's when I'm describing on both end the reasons why I think these two would really connect and and hit it off
19:28What Does the Process Look Like for Your Client?
Serhiican you break down the sequence for someone who might have never used the service that you're offering what what what what what is what is the stepbystep process for a man for example oh he comes to you he do obviously you're you're talking you getting to know him are you then looking specifically for him and then you are kind of meeting with women or you like where do you have where's your uh like database not I don't want to call it a database but Network is this all your personal Network or you you can be looking for a woman also outside of your network according to like some some criteria set by by a man
Marnisure uh so when I take on a client and the first thing I would do with him is we do what I call my intake interview which is you know sounds very formal but it's a very casual relaxed meeting where we're just talking about uh his interests uh things that he you know learn a little bit talk about his work things he enjoys doing outside of work talk about his family um and I get a sense of him just as a person then we cover the dating history and then what he's looking for as we go forward so that gives me kind of a good good understanding of my client to start I work with my clients for a year so I'm getting to know my clients very well from that point on sometimes the people who come to me as clients I already know them Fair really well I've set them up before they like the prod process now they want to see things on the other end of the um the other side so so we start with that meeting and then during the course of the year I'm finding appropriate matches for that person and that means either in my current Network and also searching everybody if it's a search and that means tapping into the people I know and I'm very lucky and proud to say that my network you know will happily think of who they they know uh for my clients because they they know they'll be in good hands whoever they sent to me to be set up um and they've had a positive experience you know being set up by me or they know someone who has um quick aside I've had therapists send clients to me because my clients have talked about me in like their therapy sessions and they will tell it's happen several times I mean my that my name is if someone just reached out they had someone talking very positively about me at a Shabbat dinner I mean so people you know that really great word of mouth is very helpful because they can reach out to somebody um reached out to a guy I don't know a couple years ago I set him up he was now married I said would you have any friends just like you because I if you were single my client would be a match for this woman I was working with and he said yeah I do I have a great friend he's single let me see if he's game set him up with my client they are now married and have two boys I mean that is the process you know just so but it's to me tapping into my network I also do searches I have what I call Scouts they're people have full-time jobs but they're just networkers and they're you know independent contractors uh but they enjoy connecting in general so they're not my employees but they're my Scouts and they'll send people to me throughout the year hey I met this great guy I met this great girl he's single she's single they want to be set up and then occasionally I collaborate with other matchmakers I have a few matchmakers that have developed a really nice relationship and we always are meeting you know new people on our own and sometimes I help them they help me so I'm utilizing every way I can to bring new people into my network I don't advertise so uh it really is personal connections and relationships occasionally I'll post on my social media hey I'm looking for someone wonderful who fits X Y and Z I get a million responses that way and I have a marriage that came from a post directly I posted something and I got a response and so I have a you know lot of connections on social media um so it's really tackling it in every which way I can to bring new people into the fold some people people find me daily and then I'm always finding people too
Marnioh but I also want to answer answer part two of your question CU you asked me to walk you through what it looks like when I take on somebody so I'm setting up my client throughout the year we're having feedback you know I set up drinks I like drinks for a first date versus dinner for reasons that I didn't get into um but they're meeting for drinks not coffee not dinner it's just a nice first date um we're talking about you know after the date feedback what did they like where did they feel like there was connection maybe what wasn't a it all that feedback is helpful but I also want to add part and parcel of what I do and what many matchmakers do is coaching and that's throughout the year
24:00Benefits of Coaching
Marniand I really feel like everybody benefits from coaching even someone who's just an absolute rock star you know wonderful person socially charm charming and very Savvy I I still feel everyone benefits from the feedback from the dates the feedback from the observations that I notice as I get to know them and that can be coaching can be in many forms it can be why are you picking the people you're picking for example right if someone's been single x amount of years they've had certain relationships I know their their relationship history we're talking about well let's think about the choices you've made and and the things you're putting emphasis on versus the things maybe you're not focusing on as much um so the coaching can be that the coaching can be how do you go into your date finding out what you want to know about this person sooner than later being very Mindful and intentional in your dating but not interviewing you know how what are your goals for the dates how to make the best of your dates and even then as the dating progresses how do you know and these are always tricky questions to cut things off sooner than later if something's not right which you're starting to see Flags a lot of people who've have been in Long relationships they might you know acknowledge they were Flags they saw but chose to ignore you know so that's part of like throughout the year and in a lot of ways my role really kicks in once I set my client up with someone they really like because then we're talking about how do we you know see if this person is the right person long term and then we're talking about you know the first fight how did that go down you know how did that person communicate you know how did you resolve it together what were their communication skills in a time when you were not seeing eye to eye you know when are you meeting their families have you set up I love you yet your first vacation together is right for potential you know I remember a couple I set up they're married and has uh two girls their first trip they they fought their first vacation and I talked with my client after and I said walk me through and they were able to acknowledge where they both you know could have been compromising I mean travel is compromised right it's not your way or the highway when you go away and that's kind of emblematic of relationships and marriage it's about compromise and so you know they've had many vacations since then that have gone beautifully um but those are all the I think the challenges you know in relationships
Serhiiyour services and your help and your assistance doesn't stop when the person gets into dating or even something more serious you are helping throughout the year which is really really cool and actually the fact that people are happily recommending you to their friends friends testifies to your professionalism uh as nothing nothing uh else so I I I think that this is the ultimate testimony that the person is a real professional when uh friends and friends of friends just want you to set them up with the person who you have on your raadar I mean this is simply awesome
Marniwell I appreciate that I will tell you I don't have a website I had a website up for almost for almost nine years so you know I no excuse me for nine years I had a site up and then I um took a brief time off when my son was younger came back to matchmaking and I didn't put it back up and I was telling a Matchmaker she said what's your site and I said I I don't have one at this point and she said well how do you bring people into the fault like it blew her mind that there's no sight because a lot of people that's the people will find them and upload their information and I said it it comes all through through people I know and I am very proud of that because it is a testament that uh people I've set up clients you know people who who know me in trust their friends and family with me so I I have found I prefer it that way without the site because anyone who comes to me usually knows someone I know in common not always someone might hear this podcast and reach out and I might not have that you know level of connection but um it just I think you I appreciate that acknowledgement because I I've worked really hard to get to that point where you know I I I've established my name in this space
28:30How to Manage Expectations
Serhiilet's talk about expectations expectations that your customers are walking into uh the cooperation with you what are the expectations are the expectations always as high as they can get and how do you navigate through that like uh everyone's everyone wants from what I know about you your clients everyone wants to have serious relationship but what if there is a bump in the road something happens so maybe just a general advice on uh uh finding love in this in this 2024 New Year and how did should they deal with expectations uh maybe thinking that they don't have enough time left you know because clock is ticking all this stuff
Marniso that's a great question as well I think that question may be answered on a few levels uh as far as taking on someone and what their expectations are you know as I mentioned with any business you have a learning curve uh you know I think early on in my business I didn't know sometimes who this is very early but who is the proper client and who who isn't and I think you become more tuned to identifying who you can work with successfully so for example don't you don't work with everyone right
MarniI don't I I turn people away sometimes and I I'll give you a perfect example um a little while back a client um I was working with had mentioned me to a friend of hers and her friend reached out to want to work with me and I was walking through through what I do explaining how I find the matches how I do the setups and I also mentioned the coaching and I said everyone benefits from the coaching it is is part and parcel of what we're doing um of course there are the setups but I could set you up a thousand times but if there's something going wrong on a fundamental level it's all for not you know you have to address whatever may be you know preventing from for forming that like lasting connection so she said um okay I appreciate that but I don't think I need the coaching I just want access to your network and I said you know what why don't you speak to a former client of mine who can you know even though she already knew a current client of mine that someone else who had had success with me who had some of her own like I you know I I need this I don't need that and we work beautifully together and she uh she said sure I'll talk to your um former client so she spoke to my former client just instead of me telling her about myself someone who worked with me could share the experience and what it was like to work with me and she came back and she said okay well she obviously sung your prence she's so happy um but I still want to say I don't think I need your coaching and I said to her you know what and I'd already sent her my agreement you know have a basic agreement formalizing you know our obligations to each other and I said you know what I don't think we're going to be a match and the client and the Matchmaker have to be a match so I think you're lovely I wish you well but I I actively said this because already I knew going into it the mindset is not right and I I happen to know is I never mentioned to my client I was in communication with her friends it's totally confidential I me this is a very private part of people's life and I I treat it like attorney client you know it's very prate who comes to me and I I would never uh share that with anyone it's very discreet and confidential but she on her own told my client that we had been in communication and that I had um and I had turned her away that I said I wasn't going to work with her and she said she respected it and she said my my friend was very appreciative and respected that you said that because I knew I just thought that that is already a flag to me we are not going to have success so I think when people come to me their the first mindset is I there's something for me to learn about myself and how I'm dating I don't have all the answers something I am doing may not be working yes there is the other part of what I do and why they've come to me to find appropriate matches and tap into my network and for me to do the search but those things go hand in hand I'm also screening them before they take them on as a client as I take them on as a client uh what are they looking for and what are they expecting
32:30The More Limitations — The Harder is The Process
MarniI found you know that the people have very hard and fast empirical limitations on what they're looking for tend to not have have have as much success meaning a woman who says he needs to be ex height right she's 51 but she wants someone at least six feet tall enough yeah and it's not uncommon but I I do think that women especially in their 20s I'll be honest are very height focused and then I think as maybe they're not finding the right qualities and the people they've been going out with there's a flexibility that starts to kind of come in like you know what what really matters kindness generosity reliability and as long as you know I'm attracted to him and whatever the other qualities you can be attracted if he's not six feet you know but I I I took someone who I think my third client had was literally that scenario and I wouldn't take that client now because I would say that them that's putting limitations on something that really is not the right I think the the bigger you know net you cast or you know the the more open-minded you are it gives yourself the chance to find love and I'm not talking about settling and we can always get into that uh but it's to say oh this is my age cut off this is my height expectation those are not what goes to making a happy marriage I I think that when people come to me it's it's we have to focus on what do you need what is important for you to feel fulfilled and you know challenged or cared for in your relationship and those are the qualities that we're focusing on so first of all I want to make sure that their focus is grounded in the things that matter for long-term relationship and a happy life with a partner I think that they have to understand no one is perfect and everyone comes with all their wonderful qualities and also you know their flaws and I say to them with their it's true I mean they have their own and I always say I'm sure you're wonderful I'm just getting to know you but no one's perfect you're not perfect and you can't expect Perfection from your future partner so I think it's understanding what's the most important what do you need to have and then being understanding that you know there they're going to be things I I don't like long wish lists you know that people put together and and already there's a problem if there's like a checklist um I think you focus on the core things that need to be there so there's there's that and expectations I sometimes give my clients books to read that I think would help them there's a great book that uh talks about you know what people expect from their partner what's realistic uh maybe Hollywood has created false expectations of the fairy tale happily ever after and it's not real life and um real life is tricky and as a couple you face all things together family member gets sick something happens and you have to have more than just physical attraction and chemistry you have to have like those Foundation those things that at the foundation will help you weather those things in life and that that's real life so when I talk about expectations I want them to be excited I want them to be you know really over the moon about the person I'm setting them up with and who they start dating you should never be settling off I'm ex age my clock is ticking I just want to meet somebody that's not what we're talking about but you can be excited about someone who maybe in the past you kind of didn't consider because you had your focus on the wrong qualities
36:30Women Want to Get Married More than Men?
Serhiiwhat about marriage though I I think from my Clayman standpoint women might want to get married more than men correct me from wrong how do you manage cases instances where a man he is open for a wide variety of possible scenarios long term but he he doesn't want to get married tomorrow and a woman wants to get married so how do you deal with us scenarios of this kind
Marniso I would say you know obviously in the pool of people at large there may be women who never want to get married they want to be happily involved I set up a couple over a decade ago they are not married they live together they moved out of New York together I don't know if they'll ever get married uh but they're very very happy um I'm friends with Facebook right they they travel the world together um so that's a couple I have that that that chose not to get married but they are in a committed you know relationship and as I said they live together and they've been together for 10 years but most of the people who come to me often are looking for marriage that tends and and family uh that's just the demographic that that tends to find me um and so if my client is looking for marriage and family um and you're asking yes if if if the woman is in the is in the situation where she's looking for it more immediately and the guy is like someday uh down the road yeah that that's differing timelines and it is a challenge because in especially in New York where I'm based um I think there's such a large you know quantity of wonderful smart you know kind attractive women looking for a committed relationship and the number of men eligible guys that are looking for the same is less I think Manhattan and I think probably a lot of major cities lend itself to a little bit of that Peter Pan syndrome among the men um it's it's unfortunate but it's it's reality because well for I'll speak to New York especially like that other urban areas I think are similar a lot of the guys especially they want to get grounded in their career they have certain maybe benchmarks for themselves even financially they want to get on financially stable footing there's an abundance of choices here whether it's through the apps or just going out at night socially and so I think for some men this is a big problem they don't choose because they have this this world of option and psychological Studies have shown when you get too many choices you have a harder time choosing and often don't choose so I I've had clients who men who have said I was a victim of that I was the victim of the New York you know bigger bigger better syndrome so many choices and I'm single at this point because I just never saw their own timeline you know if they want to get married and have children uh I think for those men a lot of times that kind of dawn on them in their 40s you know I think in their 30s they're still kind of you know sewing their oats and and playing the field so but I think for the women It's Tricky that's the reality of dating year um they have to weed out the guys who are time wasters and I'm helping them do that or maybe they have similar goals but not on the same time frame and um you know I try and tell the women not to lead with that because no one wants to feel pressured from the Geto this is my timeline you know dating engagement marriage family I think that can be overwhelming to some men to many men and women you you want to know that both parties are in it for the right reasons and it's about you not just like their objective um but I think it's harder for women in general I would say that's the case
39:36Setting Up The Meeting
Serhiido you facilitate open conversations between the two or you get to know everything beforehand and then you set up the meeting for the uh suitable in your opinion people or do you somehow is there ever a case where you are with the two people who you got to meet in one room
Marnithat's a great question no but I am sometimes the mediator on the phone I've never actually sat down and um guided things in that way um but I also in my that that has happened where I've able to smooth over some things so um you know I do the research and due diligence before people meeting making sure they look exactly like their pictures I'm very like the lawyer and me I'm very detail oriented and I like accurate representations when people me they know exactly what each other look like they have all the relevant uh facts going in I don't share last names of where people work just out a privacy you know basis but usually they share it on their date first date um and giving them a sense of shared interest shared you know values and so forth then they meet and things take off um sometimes after a date I'm hearing I speak to both parties after a date and it might be all great but I have this one question or one question mark and sometimes I'm able to kind of just answer that and say oh I think that was a misunderstanding in that part of the conversation that's actually I know her and I know exactly what she meant by that or I know him and and that you know not a into to Warrior focus on that so sometimes it's as small as that and then sometimes as people are dating I do hear even from not my clients sometimes they'll reach out and say I'm really enjoying getting to know so and so but I'm wondering about this or what do you think about that and even though my allegian is to my client I mean sometimes I do client to client setups I only have two client to client marriages so it's not a typical scenario usually one person is my client and the other person is in my network that just tends to be yeah um the case and I so but um so uh but sometimes someone on the other side will reach out to me and I take it as a sign of like they trust me they they W like guidance and I'm able to smooth things over and I and even though they're not my client it's it's another other benefit I can add for my client because I can kind of be their voice but not in an awkward situation I don't know if I'm really articulating it very well but I I can remember a couple I set up and the other the guy was my client and the woman reached out because she had one or two questions and at that point they didn't weren't dating long enough to you know really go there in their conversation but she wanted my input and she said I know I'm not your client but I really appreciate your time and I was able to talk to her about it and like Smooth over her concerns and you know they can continue to date so I I've never been you know in the room navigating that but I am a resource obviously for my client throughout the year but even on the other end
42:30Most Memorable Case Studies
Serhiiin in your 16 years experience like maybe I can ask you about your most memorable cases you mentioned so many uh great outcomes for your clients maybe you can get get a little bit more into your most memorable and great I would say case studies maybe basically people who are now married happily married and also the question how did your approach evolved or changed over the years
Marniokay I'll take those separately I'll start with the you know case studies or whatnot you know I I think um one scenario and I talk about this a lot because it really was so telling um was a CLE that when I presented the guy to the woman she and ially said no she said he's not really my type and I knew her type I knew her physical type was a certain look and he wasn't that but he was handsome he was a quality guy I had screened him and she was kind of resistant and a kind of she was and I had to really nudge her to go and sometimes you know my client says I'm not feeling it okay we move on but I just felt in this instance it was worth an hour and a half of her life to see and because I knew her dating history and I knew she dated EX guyy for a year or two who wasn't the best boyfriend and partner and he wasn't you know he was selfish and this and that I kind of had to use that a little with her and said look you've given lesser guys more than an hour and a half of your life and that just resonated with her for some reason you know because I knew she'd wasted time with some people who were just not respectful of her and not great Partners so I said that to her and she finally you know she agreed and um after the date she had a real good time she said I'm so glad you nudged me after the third date she said I can't believe I even resisted you know like why didn't and I said but that's my job that's my job is to to push you and consider like it's just a picture and he's handsome and you're type I know you're type but it hasn't been working for you right and and so I mean and they've been together over of Zade and they're very happy and so I'm very proud of that because I did nudge
44:50What Did You Learn in 16 Years
MarniI think what I've learned learned since I started this 16 years ago I think in the beginning I wanted every setup to be perfect right like everything matching up to what my client said and I wanted to be like I'm very mindful I'm not going to waste your time if there's some difference of whatever X is and what I learned is you can't strive for these perfect setups because a lot of times everything on paper is there and there's no chemistry and then there are sometimes where you know what there's enough good it's worth see this I'm not ass sure but you know what we'll see let's see and those Mayes have just great chemistry and they take those relationship takes and so I think I was too much of a perfectionist at first and I learned you have to take chances and so I'll tell my clients these are all the things I love about this match for you I'd love to see where you connect on this issue but it's let's see let's find out and sometimes they'll come back and they'll say great setup totally see where you were going with this I don't think we had that spark but I enjoyed myself I mean that's the worst case scenario but a lot of the maybe have been I had an amazing ton I really would love to go out with this person again so I have learned to to not aim for the perfect setup because again there is no perfect although there's some that are very very good there are times I leave a screening for someone and I cannot wait to talk to my client I'm literally calling them from the street I can't wait to De review about this you're going to love this person and there's sometimes I really feel that but a lot of times I'm like this person is quality you have so many reasons why you should hit it up and could it up and the rest is chemistry and now you can't really know once something's in the ballpark it's about getting people together and finding that intangible that spark
Serhiiwell this really speaks to me a lot I feel that a lot of times special on well with I'm 33 years 33 years old and uh I am back and forth with Tinder I install it and I delete it and specifically for the reason that you outlined that that the things that people put on their profile is just so far away from the feel that that I get from uh one-on-one meeting you know and uh I'm learning this from you right now that even though this person might not be perfect for me from the purus standpoint I might still want to give her a chance you know I had mark herberg on my podcast who's one of your clients yeah and her friend not a kind friend a friend a friend and he shared a really cool story because he's been on a dating Mark market for quite some time uh and he said that there was a lady that he's now dating I'm guessing that's what he said that at first it didn't seem like they would get anywhere but he said that there was something in her that I wanted to explore something interesting I think that was the case for the May that you mentioned that he found something that was worth exploring digging deeper and and he would just take his time and ask questions and eventually it uh it became s like a were very interesting conversation that resulted into them I believe getting together so it's very very interesting teaching moment moment for me and for maybe a lot of mens listen listen
Marniabsolutely and actually I'll do one more case study um I remember a few years back I set up a couple and after the date um they both messaged me I got her message first um and she said thank you so so much for the setup he was super quality everything you said I doubt he'll want to go out again we had some like LOLs in the conversation some like kind of awkward moments but he was he was lovely and quality and she she thought he was handsome but the date wasn't like sealess you know so I was expecting him to say that he wasn't interested in going at here he reached out to me and he said you know I've been dating long enough I have had better dates that are more like you meet and you feel like you know each other you know from the get-go like you've known Jetta forever that kind of energy he said there were some awkward you know LS he said but she was objectively cute I I enjoyed meeting her and I'd love to see on day two where things could go so I was so happy she was my client at the time uh to tell actually he's up for a second date and I love that they were both she was like very pleasantly surprising she I love that they were both open-minded to seeing let's see where date two goes date two was great date three was great it just got better and better and I tell the story they both were they both thought each other was attractive and I I think that is important because when I say you got to give people the benefit of the doubt I mean you do have you have to be attractive to your partner and I think um you know frankly if if uh in this scenario he didn't think she was like objectively cute I I don't know if it would have gone on today too but their connection wasn't like this seamless connection but what he said was like I've been dating long enough to know a first date is just a first date and they're married with two boys uh I was at their wedding and and I will tell you I love to tell their story because sometimes I have an amazing first date that people come back and say it was seamless and no awkward you know and I never get too excited about that either that's great I'm happy it was a great first date but it's just a first date and that could be over two from down the road you know three dayses I've seen that happen amazing first date three dates later it's done so I kind of liked the slow and steady build and giving people the benefit of the doubt I think sometimes in New York and probably elsewhere there's this kind of like wow me now like wow me on this first dat because I have another dat lined up tomorrow there's almost too much dating and comparing to people and people like lose perspective and I love that these two recognize all the great qualities in each other uh but knew that okay it wasn't this like perfect date one but Daye two was great three four and it built and I and I think that there's something really special about that so again I'll go back to like this advice to keep an open mind and keep your perspective on like what Ma what matters um and even if you're thinking about your dates and Mark's example it's like get take the time to get to know more like scratch the surface and you could be really pleasantly surprised whereas you might have those instant chemistry dates you scratch the service and then there's not enough there for the long term
51:30What Do You Love the Most About Your Job?
Serhiiobviously you are in incredibly passionate about what you do and I think that for me working with people who are looking for their first job I always tell them like don't look at the salary offering um but look at how you how do you do you resonate or how how you in terms of how do you feel at this job does it drive you so obvious viously you are you're supremely supremely passionate about what you do I'm wondering what are the things that you love most about your job what are the things that uh just keep you getting up every morning and just keep doing what you're doing and becoming better and better because obviously one you're one of the best at what you're doing even without a website having all this traction so what keeps you going what's your uh things that you love most
Marnithe best part of the job and probably obvious but is when you're get in the call together you the couples they just got engaged I wish I could bottle that feeling it is I mean after the parents like I'm one of the first phone calls and um that's that's the reward and then the next is you know when they're calling me to say that they're expecting you know that she's pregnant I I I feel so excited and I uh I get all the holiday cards with the families and the babies I call them Marty babies but but you know that is just tangible tangible stuff uh I was at a wedding not that long ago after the bride and groom were walking down the aisle the groom high five me I just I feel like so happy I was part of that um and it and it does drive me every day I'm always meeting new people and I'm a people person you know so every new person that I'm meeting to screen for my client I'm very lucky I get to meet wonderful people you know almost every day of the week I'm meeting people for my clients so um so that's the upside it's just that I'm helping you know as someone said just the other day choosing your partner is probably you know the most important decision you'll make in your life you know who you're going to choose to marry and raise the family with I can't think of too many other things that are are more important um so my my role in that I feel very um grateful to be part of
53:45What Is Your Least Favorite Part?
Serhiiand let me play a devil's advocate a little bit what's your least favorite thing
Marniwell I can say that when things don't work out it breaks my heart and I've had those calls too um and you know you can't eliminate heartache in what I do unfortunately it's part of life it's part of relationships and I wish I could eliminate that part of this uh process but I've set people up they're dating a year whatever it is you think engagement is the next step and instead they're breaking up and it's painful uh as I think was as much for me as for my client it's it's hard you know so that that part is that's the hard part it's just the emotional aspect these are very personal relationships and these are people's lives um and also you know it's hard for me when I set up a couple and maybe my client is interested and the other person thinks they're nice and lovely but not a match I mean that's disappointment but I also tell my clients that's part of dating no one is immune at some point everyone's on the other end of it you know it's for both sides and that that is reality and I can't create an alter alternate universe where no one you know gets rejected or someone doesn't want to pursue things um but I always tell them he just just dust yourself off and you keep going and that's it I try and be a cheerleader from my clients and stay positive I think that's half the battle your person is out there and it just takes one so something didn't work out you know take your time to yourself regroup and then go back
55:55Social Polls to Know Your Audience
SerhiiI I saw you you recently took a poll among your followers on Facebook and it was on the account of if for women specifically if they're okay if new a new man greets her with a hug or a kiss so I'm curious and and actually the the response rate was very high I I got really uh excited but by seeing how many active members you have in your network in your community this is it's another evidence that you that you keeping up with your network and uh not kind of losing it so uh how often do you maybe improve on the basis of social some kind of pulse or whatever it might be how often do you do things like that just to get their opinion from from your network
MarniI would say every so often I've been doing this long enough I feel like I have a good read of things but I am always kind of tapping into my network to see their take because things do change and evolve it just I think the younger generation like they don't want phone calls they want you to text them and I see that in the dating you know I have a client who's a little bit older he's always trying to get the women on the phone through the apps and they don't he's going for a little bit younger and and they don't want to talk you know so that's like off-putting to them so you have to kind of understand your audience and like the approach but actually that specific poll that one of my clients had sent me a video there are these guys out there who have like dating tips for men and they they kind of like teach them how to be smooth and how to do this and he had sent me a video where a guy was showing men how you go in for the kiss on a greeting someone on the first date and he sent it to me and and we were talking I said he did it really smoothly but you know I don't know if everyone wants that let me pull the the people in my network because you know you're following this guy on YouTube that's telling you to do X Y and Z to be a smooth dater but let's hear how the women really want to be approached and I think that the result of those those women I have about 4,000 connections on Facebook and um I got a decent turnout and they were saying it's very individual and that's kind of what I'm always telling him read people's body language I've sent clients books on body language it is so important when you're on a date to be attuned to your own body language and the body language of the person that you're out with and so a lot of women don't want to be kissed but especially if it's an app they don't know you that kind of physical contact is too much right away but a lot of women commented well they've been developing a rapport before we've met it might be okay or a hug you know um but so I think it's being a smart dater and understanding to pay attention to the woman you're with
57:56Dos and Don'ts During Dates
Marnium and it's funny because I have a client who's dated a lot he's new to me I set him up and then the woman said well he's obviously an inexperienced data and I went back to him and I told him that I said it's ironic because I know you're not but some of these things that you're doing make it see that I think that's very telling so let's let's figure out what you're doing for for example another thing I've pulled not on Facebook but just through my network was do women want the man to offer to walk them home maybe they don't want him to see where she lives you know maybe if he doesn't offer he want a gentleman I mean these are all kind of like right like the dos and don'ts of first dates and and I don't even know if it's there's no everyone has their own take on this there's no necessarily one clear answer but I think that's why you can offer you know don't insist if she says no it might be a flag she doesn't want you walking her house for whatever reason maybe she's not romantic
Serhiipermission based we use it in sales and it could be working in relationships and dating too like can I his you or can I hug you
Marniyeah and and I think even the the end of the date thing is very I think saying you know happy to walk you home or wait for her to get into an Uber I think women don't like when the guy just says bye and walks away and you know they're left on the corner and it doesn't happen often but I can tell you it's happened and I'm thinking what are these men thinking even sometimes when they're interested in the woman but that doesn't show like a kind of protective caretaking energy from you right but you want to make sure that she gets home safely and I'm sure she will but when you just leave her you know at the spot and go about your own way it kind of shows your own you're in your own world and not really paying attention to her needs I mean so those are some of the things that you know that I talk about with my clients as far as dos and don'ts that you may or may not be aware of that you're doing that send messages
59:55Do Women Want to Pay for Themselves?
Serhiiwell this a sensitive playground because sometimes I mean often times women want an alpha male someone who is decisive but with the everything that's going on in the world right now it seems like men might be intimidated of being too decisive you know so may I don't I don't I'm not sure I want to get into this too much but do you over the years have you noticed that women don't meant to pay for them or started you know having doubts about this on the first date these sensitive sensitive uh areas that make men and men quote unquote you know and with women and The Feminine all the movement that we got in the world maybe you can give me some of your thoughts
Marniokay this is a sensitive topic and It's Tricky But to answer your question have I found that women don't want for men to pay for them the answer is no the answer is no es first um as reality um I I think for first date even though it's you know 2024 there is a little bit of a sense of old-fashioned dating and ROM rtic I think if you're going dutch it's not really romantic right um I think it's nice maybe in the beginning the man treats once or twice then the woman picks up you know at some point or they go for dinner they wait for drinks she gets the drinks then the guy gets the dinner I I I know we're in a you know kind of I don't know I don't say Terror incognit but you know there's an unknown you know the society has changed in the last few decades right um but still I think women still want to feel I don't know like romance and feel like there there there's dating this isn't work this isn't friendship so so I think in that regard I think those kind of old at least in my network those kind of old fashioned rules apply as far our Unwritten rules that the first date it's going to be the gentleman's treat you know he he invited her out I think in rules of etiquette right whoever does the inviting they treat in my instance I'm setting them up but we kind of position it as if the man is taking her out and he and it's and it's just drinks for my setups anyway it's just drings um ultimately they go to dinner if they're hitting it off and usually you know day two I think is on the guy but at some point I tell women it's important to reciprocate
1:02:30Women Prefer a Man to Have a Plan
MarniI had a guy tell me once that he went out with someone I don't know six months and uh she never even bought a pack of gum in his presents you know for herself she's made him to fa her everything and that was a big turn off to him but you know what I think is interesting about this alpha male thing is um you know I think women still want the guy to kind of take the lead in the dates and that is one of the biggest kind of complaints I hear from women about just even initiating the date is a when a guy doesn't look have a plan because even though yes we're talking about where we are in society and you know feminists and and things that were on equal footing and none of that is negated in my opinion by in this very specific area of relationships the guy kind of taking the lead for the first date I can tell you when for better what they they want that God to have a plan hey what are you doing Thursday how is this time would this spot work for you and not leaving it to the last minute it is very unattractive to the women when there is no they don't know what they're doing like day of right and that doesn't happen with my setups because I know so man should know where when all like everything planned out because it speaks to a man's decisiveness and his power in a way right he's not wondering he knows what he wants it
Serhiiwell his decisiveness and effort I think it goes
Marnithere's two problems here one is if you show that you're thinking of a spot ideally that's convenient for her or mutually convenient not you know around the corner for him and she's trekking across town that tells you something um but you know I think when it shows he's giving it thought and he has a plan it shows he's excited and he's putting effort into this and two yes it's like a little bit take charge and For Better or Worse you know I have women who have very you know demanding jobs they're very thriving in their workplace and they said I'm kind of in control during the day in my workplace and I kind of want with dating like for someone to to take charge and make the plan and if you you know some guys may say I'm not down for that and that's fine but I will tell you a lot of the women I know they they want that they want the guy to put in some effort make a plan if by the night before the guy hasn't confirmed what they're doing and when I mean they're half checked out already ready and if they go in the date I will tell you guys there's already a little bit of a frustration now in the energy because you didn't you know put in that effort you didn't let them know when are we meeting if they have to reach out and say hey are we still on for tomorrow where are we going you know you're already buy an eightball a little bit um so I would offer that advice to guys yes there's still that desire for the women for you to um just be proactive and have a plan
Serhiiat the same time you rais a really great question about I think it's challenging for men now women want an alpha male but they also want someone who's in touch with their emotions and communicative and not to you know toxic masculinity and like where's the balance
Marniand that's definitely for another podcast because that's a whole K worms um but know yeah a good topic for future Days
1:05:50What is Love and Final Advice from Marni
Serhiilet's wrap things up what would you like to say as we end this episode maybe you can give your definition of love because Love is in the air and is not only in the air on 15 14th of February should be in the air uh every single day so what is love for you and um any last word that you w to leave our uh viewers and listeners with
Marnisure I'd love to offer some advice as I wrap up just so that people might listen to this and think what can they do to increase their chances of finding love obviously hiring a matchmaker is one possibility but that's not always for everyone and there's many other things you can do to be proactive so I'll startor with that and then I'll address you know what is love um I think you know as far as advice I want to give for anyone listening who feels frustrated in not meeting their right matches I would say shake things up you know I think whatever you're doing maybe it's not working for you so try something different if you're relying entirely online get out in the real world be so social pick a few things to do and just put out good positive energy to attract people to you smile let them know you're open to engaging in a conversation be thoughtful about where you're going to go and do what you're going to do and be social is it the right crowd the right demographic the right age for you but I would say don't rely exclusively on apps I I think people have gone kind of lazy with that and and they're just not going out into the real world where all the potentially you know Wonderful matches could be I think if you're on the apps shake up what you're doing on the apps maybe refresh your pictures put some new pictures out there that are current and accurate that will get your someone's attention change up your answers to the questions change up your search parameters maybe you know move the age range a little bit move the height thing move whatever give yourself the chance to increase a larger pool of people on the apps spread the word to people who you know who love you and maybe they don't know that you're really ready to get out there and date again and maybe they know somebody so I think Not In Like A desperate you know way but in a very organic sweet way tell your hairdresser tell your whomever hey U my resolution for this year we're still only in February uh is to meet somebody great and not be afraid or embarrassed to say that it's the most basic need to want companionship in your life and love so I think just think about what you're doing and think about what you can do differently in this new year um and as far as what is love God that is something I don't know philosophers over the centuries I've tried to give a good definition so I don't know if I going to have any more success but I think for me what I see I think love is really being there for your partner through this journey of Life on many levels love in a romantic way clearly you have to have that in a friendship way that when both parties at some point are going to struggle maybe with work something's not ideal or they're fighting with their soon who knows what their sibling or whatever life throws at you um friends you're navigating navigating current events the world events that affect you as a couple that you are there for each other when they're vulnerable when they need someone to help them get through something that you are that rock for them that they can rely on um I think love is and I honestly being married and any married couple will tell you love is understanding and forgiving and on both ends you know no one is perfect perfect and so someone once said the key to a happy marriage is a short memory or something and I thought that that could be true right you could hold on to grievances you can hold on to things uh or you can focus on all the wonderful things that your partner has done and continues to do for you and be grateful I think love is gratitude um and I and I think it's a perspective you realize as you get older love is not just butterflies right that's great but your love mors into something even deeper with this sh shared experience and I think if you ask couples in their 80s you know married 50 years what they would tell you I think they'd say something similar it's profound and it's something you build together
Serhiithank you so much Marty thank you for inspiration thank you for everything and um it was Mary Kagan everybody
Marnithank you so much for having me I really enjoyed being on your program and wishing everyone a year full of love ahead
Serhiiif you want to catch our podcast episodes in video format head over to the description you'll find the link to my YouTube channel Tik Tok and Instagram until the next time take care of yourself and take care of others

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