ChadSowash

the following is a conversation with Chad soash who is one of the major voices in HR industry in the US he is a co-host of famous podcast called Chad and chees podcast he is a startup advisor he is an angel investor he's a husband he's a father just an amazing amazing human being in this podcast we're taking a little bit of a different spin we speak about podcasting about how he started podcast casting how he found his path in life and other general advice for people who want to align their passion with what they make money from I hope you will benefit from this podcast as much as I benefit from it enjoy the show and if you like the show subscribe and give me a like thank you very much

Chad soash welcome to the show

thanks for having me man yeah for those of you guys who don't know me and Chad work together just want to get it get it right of the bat so we have some um dealings together my agency helps Chad and Jo with their amazing uh podcast so man thank you so much for everything I guess at this point I just want to know you better and I hope my audience will benefit from knowing you and your life experience

well our podcast is better because we work with you so I mean there's there's there's a there there's a commonality here right we're we're getting better because we actually work with guys like you so again appreciate all the hard work uh two dudes two dumb dudes can't do this alone we need help

as you say dumb dudes who've been running their podcast one the one of the most recognizable podcasts maybe the the most popular podcast in HR industry in the America you've been running for seven years now um how did it all start what did you do before you became a podcaster and how did you get to that point

yeah it takes time I mean I talk to podcasters weekly who want to start a podcast or they want to know how to become you know HR famous in our case or or famous in their specific specific industry and it's a long road man it does doesn't happen overnight I mean and I'm not saying this seven years I'm talking about before that I've been in this industry for 25 years Joel's have been Joel has been in my my my co-host has been in this industry for 25 years we've done the work we have the networks we have the relationships we have the history um that's the key and and you can't just come in I don't know how many quote unquote influencers have come to me and say I want to be like you it's like well it's going to take you about 25 years right um but I mean I was that person back in in my 20s uh and I was really shaped through my military career and and and it wasn't really the discipline as much that I did need but it wasn't the discipline as much as getting out of the country for God's sakes I was born and raised in Mansfield Ohio um very blue collar very industrial very manufacturing GM AK Steel uh and I needed to see a little bit more of the world and that gave me The Thirst to see more it opened my eyes um to more that was out there not just more from the standpoint of you know beautiful oceans and beaches and so on and so but people right and and I think we get hooked up Hooked uh into looking at our differences more than we do the humanity of things uh and you know that that to me is kind of like a daily journey and it started way back um when I was 18 and I joined the army

so it all started with you broading up your perspective and uh would would that be an advice that you would want to give to kids all over the world if they want to achieve more you got to see more

yeah yeah I mean our our oldest she actually did her last uh her last uh quarter in Budapest right so she was going to Ohio Northern she did her last quarter in Budapest uh and finished up and she was accepted to John's Hopkins in DC for polyi and she said hey can I stay and I'm like you're only going to be 22 once and when you get back here and you find a guy or a girl or whomever right and you want to have a house and you want to have kids and those types of things you're not going to have the same chances that you do now to be able to go and enjoy and expand your horizon so she's actually now uh after living in Budapest for about three years she's getting ready to go to Brighton and do her her MBA there um John's Hopkins great great school amazing school right but to be able to study abroad and to be able to be among these different cultures she's been to more countries than I have at this point I mean and that to me is amazing uh our our middle and our younger uh kids we bring them over as much as we possibly can again to expand those horiz uh I think it's incredibly important to understand Humanity when you do any job I don't care what it is any job

this is really cool that we started on this point because the name of the podcast is be yourself and U it just sparked in my mind like that when I was thinking about what I want to name my podcast and uh actually it's about finding your authentic self in life I feel like so many people live someone else's life or they do not fully live to their potential because of the reason that you just outlined it we don't know what we don't know I think Walter said it or someone that yeah there's things that at some point you just can't try because of all the obligation and obligations and constraints that you put on just as like you said at 22 years old you don't have a mortgage you don't have a wife or a husband you you don't have the limitations to try things out so kids try things out

yeah yeah well that's a beautiful thing about you know understanding like the differences again between not just people but countries you know you take a look at all of Europe all the different countries in Europe many of those uh countries are big on gapers right the US is not you get out of high school you go on the military you go directly to school right that's starting to change but in that Gap year you get a chance to to to somewhat find a little bit of yourself right and I think that's what Kennedy our oldest got to do in Budapest and she got to do it wasn't for a full year but she got to do a little bit of that and she's like you know what I want to find more of myself and I want to find more of other people um because again I don't think I think life again and this sounds so cliche but life is a journey you don't if you ever end that Journey you finally feel like like you found yourself that's sad that's very sad um I'm continuing every single day to learn to connect with people to engage and that's one of the things that the podcast has given me again being in in business for as long as I have for for decades now the podcast allows me to engage with more people and start to look at more angles of business and of humanity and the connections between those two right uh that to me and and and again the overarching macroeconomics down to the micro sides um so before I didn't have those opportunities because I didn't have this vehicle uh called a podcast called the Chad and cheese podcast to be able to do that

so seven years ago you guys started out how did it all how did it all came about what who who idea was it because yeah was it Joel's or yours give it to us

yeah know was my idea I usually come I'm I'm usually the the uh the the big idea guy right um he had uh he actually had just started a new he had a a new startup uh I had left the biggest Staffing organization Staffing an RPO organization in the world ronad where I was the director there building um you know veteran hiring programs for companies like Ford Motor Company and um and I was burnt I was done uh I wanted to get back out I wanted to work for myself Joel was working for himself he lived in Indianapolis I live close to Indianapolis uh so I said you know what I I've been heads down for two years I haven't been on the circuit doing speaking like I did before he hadn't either so we needed some kind of branding mechanism right some type of voice box uh and I and and I just saw the analytics on podcast and they were starting to hockey stick right they were starting to get to that point where everybody was uploading podcasts on their phone and they were listening and I said you know what I think this and this is in 2016 I said this is I think this is a good idea it took me about a year to get his ass off the couch uh and then um and then we started the Chad and cheese podcast a a lot from the influence of both of our wives by the way so they both I I was pitching to him and I was pitching to them at the same time at a dinner and uh we're sitting down to a very nice dinner and they both looked at him and they like what are you waiting for just do this and so that's that's where it happened

interesting and that was the rise of audio podcast in America

yep yep because right now we're seeing the uh hockey stick basically in video podcast a lot of people are turning to videos now but I understand it's still Americans staying in traffic being U I don't know washing dishes listening to your favorite podcast is way to go yeah yeah whatever yeah absolutely

okay and over years when did you understand that this can get you somewhere that this can be the primary source not only of your interest and uh attention but money as well when did when did it become something that could actually pay your bills

well one of the stipulations in starting the podcast was that we have a an audience that say say they want to hear this and number two we had somebody who'd pay for it so on day one we had sponsors um we came to the market with a pitch uh again like any startup would so we were we always viewed the podcast as a startup business right we we always did uh and so we had a um we had a sponsor on day one uh the very next podcast we had two sponsors then we had three sponsor and then in about six months and and I attribute this more to us being able to Target uh a gap in the market in our market and our voices being able to fill that Gap right and our experience being able to fill that Gap and talk the product Market fit yeah yeah and then our way of actually vocalizing that right so HR is a very very you know buttoned up kind of kind of right you know kind of uh industry well we came out of it and said fuck that this is not about being buttoned up this is about being able to actually say what you're thinking yes sir and if and if you were two guys that which is what we were two guys at a at a conference and you you were at the last day and you were at a bar having drinks what would you be talking about what would that sound like do you think people would listen to that and we got we had uh we we said that the stipulation was at least a 100 people said they had to listen they would subscribe we had 400 so we we we blew that out uh we had a sponsor we had two or three sponsors within the first month or so so at that point it was great after six months it's we started to see a huge uh explosion in our downloads and our obviously Impressions and engagement on social media um and then in January of 2019 I went full-time with the podcast Joel was still working on uh his startup uh but I told him look this deserves more time uh I'm going to break away from Consulting I know that this can actually if we put time and effort into it this can actually be a a a primary revenue driver and it wasn't too long after he joined me and we were both full-time on the Chad and cheese

how though did you come up with the concept because so many people try things out not understanding clearly why they do what they do maybe why is a question more of an internal internal question of self right but I mean how did you understand the Gap in the market was it so obvious but were you just fed up with people not being able to speak their mind

yeah I mean I I was starting to get into podcast and I listened to a podcast called pod save America right and and this was a podcast about politics but it was an explicit podcast and they were saying things that you know people wanted to say on TV but they couldn't right because they were censored totally got it so it was like wait a minute this is how it sounds when me and my me and and Friends get together at conferences or we're on conference calls or things like that in our little safe bubbles right what if we got out of that safe bubble and we started to have the discussion like normal people and that's the thing and we're starting to see this in politics especially in the US we you know we've got a a VP um candidate named uh Tim Waltz and that guy seems like the guy next door he seems like the guy who would mow your lawn when you're gone for Holiday right he seems like that guy the guy that you would go and say hey I need some help with my uh you know with with with my garbage disposal or something like that and he would come over and help that to me me that brings people in it draws people in nobody was doing that nobody everybody was talking very warm and fuzzy and oh isn't that great and yeah that's wrong but we should fix that you know but they were not talking about the serious things that we knew they were thinking about because we heard them say it so we said you know what let's just go ahead start throwing F bombs start doing whatever we needed to do just get our voice out there and uh there was nobody nobody in the industry that was doing that we had some that were saying that they were edgy um but they were just saying that they they were edgy they weren't edgy we were fucking edgy

so the ingredients understanding how you are different being blatantly truthful about stuff having the The Experience knowing what to talk about that's the second ingredient and having a partner can you elaborate on would you do this alone if if Joel wasn't around how important partnership in your life and in business in general and from your your startup adviser you still a lot of young folks MH what what I mean I have my better experience with co-founders it didn't work for me so I do understand that it requires certain maturity yeah to to make it work so how do you view partnership how important is this for you

I I don't believe my voice is the end all be all uh not to mention I want to learn uh so I need somebody else there to bounce things off of and Joel and I I think our listeners it's funny they actually say I love it when you guys don't agree on stuff y I love it when you come to the the conversation from different sides and then true and then we have people that we interview on the podcast right and and they bring an entirely different angle to it so for me it was a personal decision I didn't just want to sit there and monologue um and I thought that Joel I mean there's a couple of things I was actually in radio for a short time before I got into this industry and so I understood uh morning morning drive formats and personalities and those types of things and you rarely see a morning show host that's by themselves rarely right it's generally cheap radio stations how Howard Stern has Robin right and then he has a cast of of others around them right some of the the bigger uh shows that I actually worked at with Bob and Tom which was which was a syndicated radio show out of Indianapolis but it was syndicated all over the United States two guys they had three other people around them so there was this this these different and diverse voices that were actually coming out and to me I thought well right out of the gate let's at least start with two

I think that the fact that you were friends beforehand helped yeah I think I mean here's here's an interesting nugget that I F discover for myself actually right now I'm hearing helicopter just flying over my my street which which we never ever seen It's actually an American Helicopter saying the police right you know that I saw the helicopters like this like playing grand GTA or three or something and hopefully it's a Blackhawk hopefully it's a Blackhawk yeah anyway I was about to say that I do like podcast where I invite guests I don't have a co-host but I quickly realized that the best conversations happen with someone who you have connection with so you established some kind some sort of a connection because you're just more relaxed right yeah and uh you can you can dive into things deeper so it's definitely a a very beneficial idea to have someone around uh yeah but some people just okay talking talking on their own for ours that's that's great yeah totally I I can't do it I I I can't listen to myself

not to mention it was funny too I didn't think about this but you know Joel's voice and my voice are so much different and when we started at the audio podcast um that that made a big difference because there were other podcasts where there were Duos and the voices were just too much alike and people couldn't tell and when we would start to talk to our listeners about just the the different aspects of what they liked about the show um they liked that obviously we argued uh they liked that we you know we we were authentic we were real which they actually meant that we would you know throw out the F-bomb every now and again but they liked that they could differentiate who was actually talking and I didn't I didn't even think about that when we started so you know uh that those are those are different things to think about when you're starting a podcast knowing that audio today is is only one aspect and inv video is just growing so fast

tell me more about running a business with because I know that you have you have a business that you wanted and you you said in one of your recent episodes that you will uh remake your old Consulting business is that correct and you're inviting Jeff dick CH Chason to work with you if I'm not mistaken

we actually acquired a company so Jeff Jeff is a friend and he's been a friend for a while he's getting ready to retire and he was going to walk away from his portfolio of clients and I said no no no you've got this great website it's got It's got uh content for years years right it's and you you've got an opportunity here let's talk about us buying it from you and it starting to revive catch22 Consulting um and uh and and that's what we started doing we my my wife and I Julie and I have been talking about this for a while and and being able to kind of like revive it uh and it's starting to take new life so by the end of this year catch the catch22 group um will look few much different than what it does today um they going to be uh new players actually added to it um there's just again it's it's one of those things where you have to take a look at the market and when you see such an enormous Gap in said Market uh and you have the ability the opportunity really the want to to fill that Gap um start building a bridge and that's that's what uh that's what this was but again order to see these opportunities you see when you're saying about this it seems like it's all so um natural and it's so easy it's not easy man you gota you got to really be uh um all in you know and always update yourself with the recent data

what have you learned about um maybe communication on or effective effective confrontation or uh people in general um as a podcaster over these years I mean you you've done a lot of speaking G gigs definitely help it helps to uh speak up your mind in a more eloquent way for sure having this practice on a weekly basis yeah but what other what other the things maybe I want to maybe let I want to Advocate P podcasting I want to make more people try this thing out because it's really an opportunity to connect with people who you otherwise would have no opportunity to connect right yeah um what are other let's let's go with with pros and cons yeah how about that maybe yeah let's let's go with that and maybe I will be able to add the list that you start

oh yeah I mean Pros are are pretty simple you get an you have a vehicle in which to get your voice out there to get your thoughts out there um you also have a feedback loop because when people listen they're going to tell you what they think uh which is which is actually I mean that is such a great gift uh our our our listeners and they they have no problem sharing feedback my god um they're not letting you to to to shit them you you you have to be consistent with your ideas this is interesting you have to be consistent with your ideas over all these years they won't let you change the course well but the thing is the thing is you have to be able to evolve as a person and not to mention the market always evolves so what I thought what I thought back then might have been true because adoption in our space isn't fast now that might be entirely different for the same kind of tech that happened five years ago than it did now huge difference right so I mean there are all those things and we get challenged on those all the time which is great because we get an opportunity to kind of rethink and readjust to the market itself and again as an individual who is talking to I'm I'm a startup adviser I have about 14 startups uh in my portfolio uh angel investor and then also you know we're we're building this uh we're building this Consulting uh company as well uh it is incredibly important to have a feedback loop to be able to have a time to think through what you actually mean you know it taking it from your brain to your mouth and articulating things isn't the easiest thing for people this gives you practice and how to do so our first podcast sounded like total shit we've been able to focus on us focus on the market maret focus on what we know and have great discussions with people who also know because we're not the only ones who know stuff right so from you know a pro standpoint that's a long list you get a chance to get your voice out there you get feedback loop you get engagement uh we you know obviously are on stages all over the world being able to present and then also engage people you know at at events um even VIP events those types of things so there are a lot of Pros now the cons this doesn't happen overnight uh and again you might see you know a podcast gain notoriety quickly but that doesn't mean that they haven't worked years to be able to compile knowledge experience networks those types of things to be able to make it happen not to mention when Joel and I looked at it I actually pitched it to him as a business said there is a market here and here's what the market looks like here's the podcast uh audio explosion here's what ha here's what's happening here's the top podcasts in our space none of them are doing this um so you know you have to look at all the different aspects of the actual product that you're providing you can't just think of this as pulling up a mic buying a mic and starting to talk into it you have to be you have to be focused and you have to understand who you're talking to I don't know how many podcasters I talk to and I'm like who's your audience and they're like uh they don't know they don't know who Their audience is it's incredibly important to know who your audience is who are you targeting those are incredibly important parts so the the cons uh it's a lot of work it's a hell of a lot of work and um I once saw a statistic I'm not making up I promise uh that most podcasts only last six episodes yeah yeah because it is hard work I think threshold is 20 if you get over 20 or something you're already in the majority of people who didn't give up yeah we're over we're over 1300 right now 130000 really oh my God Roan got 2,000 and you're like I'm like Jesus that's so cool

I think on the matter of to to add the list of of advantages and benefits definitely network is expanding um I feel that just having the conversation and asking questions like that builds a report there is just something about people they people love when you ask questions it shows especially if you're gen genuinely interested right yeah as a as a podcast host you have an opportunity to invite folks that you're really interested in therefore it facilitates a very nice and genuine discussion yeah and and I also I also don't want to look like an idiot asking a stupid question people say there are no such thing as stupid questions yes there are there are plenty of stupid questions

so when Joel and I actually are looking to do an interview we do our research which is again one of the reasons why you know he has 25 years in the business I have 25 years in the business uh there was one time Joel said H you know what I've been doing this for 25 years I should be able to ask good questions I was like you know what you can do that but I'm afraid I'll look stupid because I'll just blank because I won't be ready I haven't done my research and he was like you know what that's a good point nobody wants to look stupid on the mic nobody wants to look stupid on the mic

I I remember we were producing the um the one with l way and that's where you definitely fine-tune the questions that's that's where you really have to especially when you're where you're at the conference it's recfest by the way folks recfest Nashville is coming that's something that we have to mention is going to be big and and wild right yes yeah

I wanted to ask on this matter of um just what what are what are the like uh feedback what are the things that people told you that made your course correct or something of this kind do you remember some feedback from not maybe course correct but little changes that you were able to implement from your listener feedback that's really interesting especi criticism do do you get criticism

oh of course oh of course and it was funny because when we first started the podcast we had um had a bunch of people come out and say you can't say that you can't say that and uh you know you'll get blackballed you can't say that and I'm like well then then we will but this is the format and this is what we're doing so you've got to be able to go against the grain sometime but then we were at a it was actually in Nashville it was for it was for a a show um in Nashville and there were some uh our ladies that were coming up to us and were like we listen to your podcast all the time and I always ask first and foremost I say thank you so much for listening please tell our your friends um but why do you listen and they said well because you say what I've been thinking for 30 years and you're authentic and my next follow-up question is okay what makes you think I'm authentic and that was where and that is when they actually said well you you know you you cuss and I said so me dropping the F bombb doesn't bother you and they're like oh no oh no that's a sign of you know authenticity so at that point at that point we were actually trying to curb back the F bombs and we were going to what we call a PG-13 model in a PG-13 model of a of a of a movie in the United States you get one F bomb that's it right you get one that's what you're allowed in a PG-13 rated movie in the United States so that's the model that we were trying to go through because we had some people saying they were too harsh some people and then we had these others saying no and this is these are the audience that we wanted right and so I kept asking kept asking kept asking and I kept getting the same responses over and over so we dialed it up we're like okay fine we're gonna go just raw Joel raw Chad that's what the people want that's what they're going to get and that is when we really started to explore because people could tell that we weren't holding back and they don't want you to hold back they don't want us to hold back

let's just say that your podcast might be different Out There Our podcast they didn't want us to hold back on the on the point of stupid questions I think that sometimes I'm going to disagree with you respectfully here I think that sometimes people want to want to hear you asking dumb questions or showing that you are not perfect in any shape or form because that in a way gives them the permission also not to be perfect I think there's so much Perfection beautification on Instagram and social media no one's showing that they're in depths or they have uh problems everyone's just so fucking successful right sometimes showing that you not perfect that you're imperfect just enables other people to relax and that's why I think we love podcasting because it's raw it's not edited when we edit your videos for Clips I I I I I I I kind of limit I don't want my editors to cut out all the uh because you think it makes you look like a human not shit cut it to just you know what I'm saying jump so I think the the the the it's really really under uh rated uh in podcasting that that we really want people to not be perfect we want people because that just allows us to be to be like that

so Joel and I Joel and I actually point out our imperfections all the time so we don't have to worry about that right it's yeah so I mean you actually make fun of each other yes yes and and that that's the dichotomy that we have which is which is great um but then again it makes me have a tip on my shoulder so I can't ask dumb questions uh because people already know I'm flawed right they they so so again it's it might be different if you're monologuing or you do have a one-on-one uh you you can do all those things but I I do agree 100% there were so many HR podcasts before we started that sounded not so polished from the standpoint of like sound because they all pretty much sounded like shit audio-wise but there but they were like it's like they were staged yeah like you know I'm going to ask you this question what's your answer going to be so I can get a followup right and from our standpoint there are a lot of people who are literally they'll say they were afraid to come on our podcast because they will ask okay so what questions are gonna ask us you'll know when we ask you know when we you never give them the list or something no there's never no and and nobody has ever demanded a list of questions um and they know the kinds of questions that we're going to ask they're not going to be the the softball questions and if it is a softball question that's because we have a curveball coming up so you know oh shit wait a minute that was an easy question there's got to be a followup they know something that I don't know and that's the thing is that we always want to try to keep our our interviewees on their toes and at the end of it for the most part the anticip IP ation is always generally worse than the actual uh performance of it right so at the end of it they're all likeo that was easier than I thought it would be it's like good that means that means you prepared

it's interesting that you said that because just recently I had uh like unsuccessful attempt to get to get a famous artist somewhat famous artist uh electronic artist and he connected me with her man his manager and the manager requested the list of questions and you know and I had to do all the research and my homework and created this this list and eventually they declined you know so for I I don't think that I'm I'm I'm I'm at my best thinking about what I'm gonna ask in advance my brain just doesn't work this way man I feel like the person who I'm who I'm talking to and questions just pop up in my mind I don't know so it's it's interesting

that's how normal conversations happen right and and if if you know from your standpoint if you're trying to get somebody on famous and uh I would just have a list of five questions and just throw them that and then just ask question yeah then just never ask those questions because once they're on the mic they're on the mic yeah

interesting interesting so actually you know on this on just to wrap up this little little uh uh topic I I I remember in my business years when I was running a business with my co-founder he was so insecure uh when he didn't know all the answers in the world and for some reason I have no problems um recognizing that I don't know stuff that I have the answers but he was really really insecure when he had to uh admit that he didn't know something right and maybe that was the reason why it didn't work out for for us it all ended uh with a conflict and him and investors kind of helped me leave from my own company which was a pretty traumatic experience for me that I'm finally getting over now because I found something that I love right now and I don't have a co-founder I don't have a partner I just run the business on my own and uh I feels just great because you know some for some maybe I would I would be okay running a business with someone at this point as I'm more mature but yeah I mean the it just requires C certain level of growth uh personally and uh mentally and intellectually to to just run things things together with someone hey yeah it totally does

the question about working on camera or or or being in front of the crowd uh I heard from um Charles Barkley you know this guy he's a pretty pretty welln yeah and he's he was selling that he was telling that they were inviting different fellas who they who were exceptionally outspoken great great guys when they were talking in person privately but they but they when they turned that camera on something happened so yeah they got frozen dear in the headlights did you have did you have this uh this fear of of camera or what what how do you how why PE some people can't express their thoughts and be themselves be there authentic selves in front of other people or just the camera

so um I was lucky enough that I went through training that most people will never go through in their lives uh I was actually uh a drill sergeant infantry Drill Sergeant the United States military so I went to drill sarden school and we were up on a platform training uh hundreds of individuals at a time and we had to get into a certain Persona a certain mode right I called it God mode um but the thing is to be able to get into that mode you have to be an expert right because you can't be questioned on anything that you're actually training on you have to know what because they expect you to be God right you have to run faster you have to you have to fight harder you have to be smarter all of those things all of the time and uh so I was lucky enough to be able to go through that incredibly hard course and then be a drill sergeant on you know on you were saying like yeah yeah yeah so I I went through that and then when I got back into my corporate life I understood and this is one of the things that I tell my wife my wife is in is an expert in in her space as well um is that nobody in the room knows knows more than you do period period they might have different aspects of what they know but on the core competency of the subject that you're talking about you can say I don't know you can say you know what I don't know about that but my experience says over here X Y and Z and you should be comfortable in saying that but when it comes down to specific areas of expertise um I'm going to blow everybody in this Auditorium out because I know that I am an expert in the space so that gives you the confidence to be able to say things that most people are kind of cringey to say if you are not confident in what you know and who you are right and knowing that we're imperfect as humans anyway I don't mind being wrong and if somebody helps me understand where I'm wrong that's awesome because guess what I just learned something that means I'm getting better that means I'm being even a better expert than what I was before so taking the chance being uncomfortable is what I preach on a daily basis getting in researching things I know nothing about talking to economists talking to people who you know and trying to really understand this this thing we call business we call Workforce we talk we call Economy and how they all work together uh you know I I'm a kid who went straight into the military from high school I did a little College didn't graduate college because the corporate world sucked me in and that was that is where I just excelled and that's where I learned that's where I I I was on the job training to be quite Frank so anyway for me that is the biggest key is that you have to be knowledgeable you have to do your research you have to have those network connections and you have to challenge yourself and be uncomfortable on a daily basis and then this this is nothing

so in order to grow you got to be comfortable and uncomfortable yeah always do something that you you're okay okay just tap into unta territories every once in a while right yeah I think Joe Rogan's preaching about this thing that you in order to do in order to uh perform in front of thousands of people giving standup For example he he he says that it's it's not so uh intimidating for me is every single day I challenge myself with things like uh cold clunch right the the ice water that he's get get into every single day or doing martial arts in his young years uh so he says that if you intentionally do something difficult you know then the difficult things will not be as difficult right yes yes so you got to intentionally create this Zone on uncomfortable for you and go go challenge yourself which which is super um um not it's not intuitive for human being to to go do things that are super uncomfortable right right so yeah and I I sit here in in my apartment and I think maybe I should go and create some sort of an event for example and invite people and and record a conversation in front of a crowd or something of this kind that that's the challenge that's going to be a Growing Experience

yeah and it could be it could be little things too I mean well little things are big things but I mean it was funny because we um in Vegas uh you know we we jumped off the stratosphere that's that's over over 250 meters right and we jumped I mean it was it was uh it wasn't a freef fall we had a cable attached to us but we had people that went with us I was in the military that stuff doesn't bother me but there were a bunch of other people that went with us even Joel who you could tell they were jittery this was something that made them incredibly uncomfortable but after that oh my God we this was a bonding moment right so don't just do these things by yourself do them with other people as well you will find a bonding moment you will find that time that story and those connections that you wouldn't have had before

Chad why many people do the things that they don't love doing why they spend eight nine hours a day which constitutes I don't know the bigger part of their life coming home exhausted not wanting to live why they keep doing what they're doing why it's so difficult to to change uh the entire course of your life

yeah sometimes it's opportunity again growing up in a in a very poor Blue Collar manufacturing town uh that's all the jobs that were available and they those individuals had families and they had to do something to be able to you know make ends meat uh for the family to keep you know uh food in their mouths and and and Roes over their heads so sometimes you get into situations where the opportunity is just not present and you don't have the the money to be able to get out of it uh you hear you especially when you have kids right so you feel like you're locked into something like that um Julie and I are at the point right now kids are out of the house um I'm kind of like disheveled I'm not even starched and or anything like that because we have a place here on the southern Co coast of Portugal now we don't have kids we don't have to worry about that we can get out right so sometimes the Escape happens later in life but the big key is to have that point of escape and understand what it is and where it is uh and then start to plan for that and maybe the Escape is just a couple hundred miles away but it's just out of the town that you're in now uh maybe it's a side hustle this podcast was a side hustle yeah this was this was not meant to be the business if if it if it would have I I mean if somebody would have said hey this is going to be your full-time business one day I would have said wow that would be amazing I would love that but there's no way in hell uh how unless you get out and you do those side hustles and those types of things uh you'll never know so just again push yourself be uncomfortable and uh I'm lucky enough to have one of the best Partners in the world and know I'm not talking about Joel he's great but my wife uh Julie you know she is a very strong and determined woman and uh she's a leader and uh when I wanted to leave ronod she's an executive director at disability Solutions uh you know that I was going to that was going to take a huge cut right I'm going to go from something to nothing and she said that I'm confident that you will I'm confident whatever you put together is going to be fine don't worry I got this that's where the whole thought process of of support and having a having a network and then also having a partner is incredibly important Joel has also been an incredible partner on the podcast you know I pick up where he leaves off he picks up where I leave off and and we just have this flow in friendship that it it means a lot and it means a lot that we're in business as friends um not everybody can do that uh we we do have to take some time away from each other because that's good for a relationship but other than that I mean it's it's just great to find those those Partners

definitely you're blessed with great partners and for me it's a point of uh it's a great lesson you know that I got to choose the woman wisely because I I've been told this on numerous occasions that your woman will will will be very very uh fundamental uh in instrumental in how your life will um sort of unfold because she can either support you and in the moments of uh I don't know like some sort of depression even support you and as as you said if you're taking cut and say saying honey uh I'm not going to be able to provide at this level for some time what she's gonna say how she's going to react yeah yeah but that's a topic for a different discussion on how to choose a woman maybe you'll how to choose a partner how to choose a partner right d I don't care Ma male female whatever you want to choose that's great but again it is important to understand you know support is is necessary in life

for younger kids uh that are tapping that they're just graduating or not graduating or just thinking about their starting their career or Chas changing their career maybe they're at this point where oh my God the world is so open wide and I can do whatever I want um what do you think it's a good advice to to look at what you really love doing maybe if even if it's not uh profession maybe it's if it's not a hard skill something that you love and try to convert your passion into profession this is a signature question I ask on my podcast because I am a I'm a I'm I'm an example of someone who was able to connect I I didn't directly convert my passion MH uh but I had passion for speaking for English language and videos here comes I created the agency where we produce videos and I have a podcast where I where I'm able to um articulate my thoughts and talk to amazing human beings so that's me but I I can't say that it's it was such an easy easy transition and and it was obvious so do you have examples or can do you think that it's it's a great way to start to think about what are your what what are your passions and then think of how you can monetize them

always but it doesn't mean that your passion is going to be you know your primary right out of the gate again podcasting was not the primary we were doing consulting Joel was you know he was a startup he was a startup uh founder uh so it's not always the thing that you start that that that is your primary so you know you have to take a look at the the industry that we're in especially technology recruiting technology talent management just the whole ecosystem is incredibly um exciting for me uh being able to consult around it not so exciting you know in some cases uh being able to advise startups I thought was you know it's it's great I love it um but the podcast again was literally a branding mechanism it was a side hustle it was something that had to pay for itself uh and then it exploded so I think you know the big key here is you find something that pay the bills that you don't hate I mean you you can't hate what you do every single day because if you do it's going to take a toll on on everything you like it you don't hate it you don't love it but you at least like it and if you if you if you're lucky you love it right but always think of those things whether you call them Hobbies or whatever they are that are side hustles those side hustles you should treat as a business right out of the gate now now if you want to get into a specific area like you know again this is a a great example if I I want to be a professional podcaster okay great you should talk let let's take another example let's say gaming a lot of kids love playing games they can turn gaming into into into an earning opportunity as he's a gamer what what what does he do you need to do a lot of research and see how many of those Gamers actually go professional how long it actually took because this is not an overnight thing and just because you've been playing you know your Xbox for five years you've got people who've been playing for 20 right you've got just so you have to understand how much time it takes and it's a job and it's work and here's the thing that you're going to hate um is that that thing that you love right now you might get too much of it you might get burned out and you might have to put down the controller yeah that's the hard you'rein going to enjoy it if you do it yes so you know and if you take a look at like professional sports you know you only you only have a certain lifespan in that sport a career Span in that sport right what happens after right so you have to you have to really focus on those things um just because you love it now doesn't mean you're you're you're not going to hate it later especially after eight hours of playing a day and and then going and doing tournaments and then etc etc so yeah I mean it's it's incredibly important do your research talk to people who are doing it talk to people who've been doing it a long time and tell them to tell you the nightmares not the not the great dreamy stories but tell them to tell you about the nightmares so always always TR try things out but don't don't put all the chips in the middle of the of the table you can start out small that's what you're saying you can always start small uh and then iterate if if if you if you like something but treat but always try to believe I think I think believing that this could become a fulltime occupation is is a very a very powerful lesson here because it's difficult to believe you know I'm doing this podcast now and you told me that you might have a break if someone if a famous person I told you that I want to invite some artists on my show but it it appears now that they are the most uh sort of difficult breed to get on because they have managers who are really um sensitive about the the pr activities and so on so forth and kind of getting you know um sort of um I lose my faith that you know I'll be able to get someone but you know maybe the time will pass and I will have the podcast with the most number of artists for example and I'll have world now known DJs talking to me on my podcast that that's something that I really really want um so always always believe that uh and dream believe the and dream dream that everything is possible believe dream it but plan plan plan again you you have to have if you want this to be something that can be your primary source of income you have to treat it like a business from day on you have to understand that business and if you don't understand that business it's going to be really hard for you to actually make it happen

cool hey man that was that was super super super uh insightful do you want to I don't know say something as we end the segment just leave our audience with some message from from chat from the most dangerous HR podcast

yeah yeah I think I think it's simple uh I first off I I appreciate you having me having me on the show and and if you're listening out there uh it's important and you've heard me say it a million times on the show already do your research understand that uh there are people out there that can definitely lift you up uh and there are people that are out there that can hold you down uh get away from those people that are holding you down find the people that want to lift you up and uh they will be able to point you in the right direction the support network that you can have is incredibly important because trying to do something all alone on your own is lonely and it won't last forever

yeah I agree Mana thank you so much for uh being in my corner and I'll be in yours

thanks ma'am

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